# Full Frontal results after ToS **URL:** \ **Category:** The Wahooligan Tour\ **Created:** [February 28, 2021, 5:50pm UTC](https://wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/t/full-frontal-results-after-tos/9025 "2021-02-28T17:50:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 65
**Author:** ![emacdoug](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/emacdoug/32/15557_2.png) [@emacdoug](https://wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/u/emacdoug)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2021, 10:17pm UTC](https://wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/t/full-frontal-results-after-tos/9025/65 "2021-03-07T22:17:11Z")
> [@Salsa](#): > > How does HM relate to FF, especially on FTP? Is it more accurate for some rider types than others? There’s a lot of discussion on this in different threads. Here’s a comment from Coach Mac. > [@4DP vs Half Monty results](https://wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/t/4dp-vs-half-monty-results/828/3): > > There are rider types that do “better” on Half Monty compared to Full Frontal. The main one being Attackers, secondarily Pursuiter. We have found that many people for those rider types get artificially high FTP and MAP values from Half Monty, while those who are more diesel type (TT’ers / Climbers) might see the opposite. Ramps will always give artificially high Sustained power values (FTP / MAP) for people who are “anaerobically inclined”- attackers and pursuiters. We have found that our he… > [@Salsa](#): > > The workouts suggested by All-Purpose Road obviously did a good job of improving what I was relatively good at (MAP), but did squat for my weakness on long, steady efforts. Is there a better alternative among the Training Plans to improve this? Time Trial, maybe? Or a DIY combo heavier on FTP-focused workouts? I’ve had your same experiences. The All-Purpose Road plan did a great job of bringing up my AC and MAP, but my FTP stayed the same. I switched to the Metric Century Plan which included a lot more endurance and Z2 riding, and again, my AC and MAP came up some more, but my FTP stayed the same. Tho the results did vary between HM and FF. I consistently get a 20w higher FTP when doing HM instead of FF. You can always do the 4 week Building Blocks: FTP Block plan. Or the Time Trial plan. Or the Century Plan. Something that focuses on longer rides. But like you said, genes are genes and maybe we’re meant to be Pursuit riders rather than diesel engines. 🤷‍♂️ You could also try riding Cobbler 2 or 3 times a week and see where all the sweet spot training gets you. 😁 > [@Salsa](#): > > Speaking of the outdoor season, are there ways to adapt a training plan to outdoor use? I do love my Kickr, but it’s still second best to the real thing and I will almost certainly be outside before the end of another 12-week program. Some of the plans (like the Century Plans) include both indoor and outdoor riding. You do your shorter focused sessions indoors and then do 2 longer rides outside. --- _[View the full topic](https://wahoox.forum.wahoofitness.com/t/full-frontal-results-after-tos/9025)._