Expected harder training session

2nd day of visit to SUF.

1st day, I did Full Frontal. Today, I did 14 Vise Grips. I expected it to be hard, that I would really squeal. But it wasn’t. It left me with plenty of fuel in the tank.

So, do I just thank Gods of SUF for that, or:

  • immediately adjust relevant numbers in 4DP or
  • do few more sessions and see if I need to adjust 4DP numbers
  • or accept the fact that training doesn’t have to be always an ‘all-out’ thing

Give it a few workouts to see how they feel. Are you following a training plan? Some workouts in a training plan are set at a reduced intensity, which might be why it feels easier.

If you continue to find things a bit too easy (I never found 14 Vice Grips easy! :joy:) I’d be inclined to give Half Monty a go in a week or so, or perhaps toward the end of your first rest week. FF can be tricky to pace, especially if you’re new to Sufferlandria, which could be a factor if your numbers are off. HM involves a lot less pacing, but will only alter FTP and MAP.


I didn’t say it was easy, I just said that it didn’t hurt me as I expected. I was more annoyed with my ANT+ dongle failing to connect (was stupid and put my wifi on channel 10 which has the same frequency).

No, it wasn’t in the plan, it was just a standalone training session.

And yes, FF was tricky, and I didn’t follow full guides, because I don’t have a WEEK to prepare for it. I just went into it instead of racing on Zwift.

Half Monty sounds like a good idea since I want to see my FTP a tad higher and MAP adjusted so I do fall on the floor after a training :wink:

This. Do Half Monty. After that, get settled in Sufferlandria for a few weeks and do FF again.


Thanks. That gives some optimism, and I was kind-a down because of low numbers.

Have you checked out 9 hammers yet? I bet you’ll love it!
Enjoy and let us know what Half Monty gives.

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2 sessions so far. I lack MAP so I choose 14 VG first…

OK, the next one will be 9 hammers!

May I recommend Revolver is Easy or The Omnium. Quite painful.

Yes you can. Adding it to the playlist. Thank you!

Did you apply your 4dp results to your profile? The 14 vice grips should have been meaty enough if they were done at 100% ( not a reduced effort workout) I take it you did not sandbag any part of the test because that would skew your results

Hi Alan, I thought results are applied automatically after, test?

There was no sandbagging during the test nor workout. During the test, my HR was above red, exactly as expected, so I think I really did my everything. I mean it went above red in the last parts of the efforts, I think I did my pacing correctly.

If you look on your passport/activities/4DP you should get one of the two screenshots, one has a red bar showing an option to apply it to the 4DP profile, and the other is in green with a tick showing the 4DP profile has been set, or applied to your workouts

Thanks. It is applied. I tried The Fight Club today, had to give up after the 3rd set (out of 5).

Seems that this kind of training beats the **** out of me.

Your numbers are impressive but it Sounds like you probably coulda gone harder on the 5 minutes (hence 14 VG not too bad) and it’s made your FTP a bit higher than it should be (hence FC too hard) half monty will tell you for sure

Thanks but no so impressive since they are under a guy with 100kg. Who had FTP of 285 two years ago…

I might try 14VG again with manually adjusted numbers, for example, 5% up on MAP.

Rather than manually later your numbers and do 14VG, I’d just do Half Monty. It’s a decent workout anyway, and you’ll get more accurate results that way. Just make sure you follow the instructions to the letter.

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Sounds to me like you didn’t pace the 5min test very well or you had a bad day doing Full Frontal compared to 14 VG. 14 VG is not absolutely savage but it is definitely NOT an easy ride. It will definitely have you questioning whether you’ll complete it at stages (usually 30secs into the 90secs effort after the 2min effort). If you felt it too easy your FF result isn’t accurate. Try Half Monty and that may offer you a better guide.

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Not sure about bad pacing, look:

Power is steady and HR reaches the maximum at the end, with almost no variations of any kind.

But yes, I will do Half Monty and see what happens.

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@mosmondor It seems we have a pretty similar 5 min FF profile. My result might’ve been affected by prior knowledge of my capabilities based on previous HM and FF results

FWIW Fight Club KO’d me in the middle of round 3 similar to you. I haven’t done 14VG yet, but it’s in my new plan. I’m looking forward to it being easy :wink:

George, that’s interesting about Fight Club; one day I might be able to complete it to the end. One of the problems with it is that ERG is useless for short efforts, and when I disabled ERG, I wasn’t able to control neither ‘recoveries’ nor attacks. Attacks went to 500+ where it needed to be in 380-400 range.

Maybe that’s the point, to be able to control it and put the power onto the right number, so by not doing so, I melted too soon.

14 VG is not EASY :slight_smile: It was just not hard as I was expecting it.

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