Is Garmin tougher than Grunter?

I did a solid FF, got my 4DP. Started the All purpose 12 week road plan. Every session completed successfully so far, albeit only 2 weeks into the plan.

All power/cadence targets are met, heart rate seems to sit between 66% and 70% of max which is where I think it should be except when a session deliberately wants me to go deep.

Garmin says I am unproductive, but surely Grunter is tougher than Garmin? Does anyone ever make Garmin happy with the effort you are putting in?

I have never found the unproductive rating on the Garmin very useful.

The First Beat analytics engine does not know what your training goals are, so it makes some assumptions, and they do not always correspond to what you aiming.

The other ratings, detraining, maintaining, productive seem to correspond better.

As another example, I have done workouts such as Violator, The Shovel, Half is Easy, 14 Vise Grips which have clear anaerobic focus. The First Beat analytics engine does not recognize those efforts under the exercise benefits.

Garmin says I’m “Unproductive” as well and from a true TSS/week and CTL standing I agree. I’ve gone from 550-700 TSS weeks to only 300-400 TSS/week. My CTL has dropped from 72 in mid December to only 64 at the end of last week.

The fact that I’m only on the bike for ~6 hours a week versus the 12-15 I was when I could ride outside is my reasoning. I have to constantly remind myself that not all TSS is the same.

I wish I could spend more hours on the trainer/turbo but if you ask me to spend more than an hour a session you need to have a gun to my head and be ready to pull the trigger. I’ve no clue how folks can do the ToS. Really, ten(!) videos in one day?

I trust in the science that I will be able to raise my FTP and MAP this making me faster so I let Garmin just speak and I don’t listen.

I will ignore garmin then by the sounds of it.

Thank you for the feedback everyone.


When Garmin tells me that I tell Garmin YOU’RE unproductive!

@Rik ToS is 7 days in a row (this year, it’s normally 9). The 10 vids back to back thing is Knighthood. Two different things but both are “fun” :stuck_out_tongue:

@Glen.Coutts KoS

Thanks for the clarification. I’ll need to read up on what it takes to be shipped into a KoS.


You can read all about it here. Knights of Sufferlandria® – The Sufferfest

10 videos back to back… To quote my grandfather… “That dog don’t hunt”. You would need to hold a gun to my head regardless of what settings I’d use.

Thanks for the quick reply.



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Lol!!! Membership does has its privileges :wink:

The Garmin Unproductive is the same for me. I follow the prep plan for TOS and the bloody Garmin says unproductive. I knocks my confidence and feel that Garmin and Sufferfest are at odds. I love Sufferfest so I am sticking to the training plan and will have to ignore the Garmin.

Actually, I’m in week 4 of the all purpose road plan and my vo2 has started going up and Garmin says I am being productive. It feels like Garmin has a built in disposition for you to be constantly doing aerobic and anaerobic workouts. If your sufferfest plan has you in a base or ftp phase, garmin will say you are unproductive because it prefers more variety.

I’m now productive for over a week and that includes rest and recovery days.

But I’d still ignore garmin and stick with the sufferfest plan. I feel like I’m getting big improvements very quickly without having to destroy myself on every ride. The plans include the right amount of rest and recovery to ensure you grow stronger and can put the effort into the sessions when you are supposed to, and eases up when you need to.

I’m off to drink my sufferfest koolaid. Forget that, just plug it straight into my veins…




Be sure that your FTP in Garmin is the same as from Sufferfest. After I do a 4DP, I always forget to change my FTP in Garmin.

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Thanks I have also taken my LTHR and used that in Garmin. By keeping the faith with Sufferfest my Vo2max has gone from 42 to 44 in two weeks

No I did a weeks worth of training last week running and cycling was unproductive the whole week :rofl::rofl::rofl: don’t know how Garmin calculates anything and even better is there poor/fair/good comment after about 5 minutes into an activity, what’s that about for most people 5 minutes in your still partly doing a warmup utter nonsense

I spoke with garmin about a year ago, so not sure if anytihng changed in the app since then as far as the productiveness, but I was told that the only activities that Garmin recognizes are outdoor rides, or if you have a specific speed/cadence sensor that you are also using that is synced to your garmin. My activities crossed over from Sufferfest into my Garmin activity log, but indoor rides did not count towards productivity until I added a dedicated speed sensor just for the Garmin