Santa is all set up to drop off a Wahoo Kickr Snap for Christmas. I’m looking forward to moving from my dumb trainer (Kinetic Road Machine) to one that’s not so dumb. That said, the RM has served me very well.
My question is directed to those who are familiar with the Snap. Did you ever regret going with the Snap and not spending the the extra $ for one of the other Kickr models?
It seems to me the Snap will be a nice step up for me but am wondering if more is really that much better.
I went straight for the Kickr Core (didn’t want the rubber flying around my bedroom and the hassle if properly mounting it to not have it spinning through.) and am still happy
The best thing about getting a smart trainer for me was getting ride of the tyre. My wheel on trainers needed calibrated more often, the tension knob adjusted every ride, tyre pressure checking every ride, it spray rubber all over the floor, puncturesm, wheel slip limiting power on short efforts and sprints.
I bought a budget direct drive trainer for the same cost as a Kickr SNAP, trainer tyre and spare rear wheel would have been.
Honestly If I was you I’d save my money until I could afford a direct drive if my dumb trainer was still working.
Agree. IMO, getting a wheel-off trainer is well worth for many reasons already noted. Wheel on calibration before every session after a warmup is a very important as the rolling resistance of the tire against the drum is highly variable with tire temp, tire pressure, force against the drum. It also sets a lowest resistance below which you can’t go, and the max torque in low gear before the tire starts to slip on the drum. Forcing the tire against the drum puts an unusual load on the tire’s tread/carcass which can cause the two to separate. Some will put on a special “trainer tire.” What I did was use a somewhat worn road tire on the trainer over the winter and change it out for a new tire at the start of the outdoor riding season. Direct drive trainers can be quieter too.
Prices of direct drive trainers have really come down lately too. A couple of years ago it was $1200, and now you can get very good ones for ~1/2 that.
exactly. When I was looking for the Trainer the Kickr Core was around 600€ with some special deal. And compared to the “hassle”, noise, dirt and new tyres it wasn’t “that much more expensive” than proper wheel on trainers
I was in EXACTLY the same situation as you @Oldcatnewtricks! I had been using a KK Road Machine and wanted to move to the “smart” world. My next trainer was the Kickr Snap and it served me very very well for about a year. If you are vigilant with your pre-ride set-up you will be very happy too. So, before each and every ride I would:
ensure the rear tire was inflated exactly to 100 psi (or whatever works for your tire)
I would turn the tension knob exactly the same number of turns on the tire to prevent any slippage (I can’t recall what that was but it may have been 1.5 full turns).
I would do a precisely 10-minute warmup spin then a spindown calibration
Doing this each and every time had my Kickr Snap power calculation accuracy and consistency to within a 1% variance tested against 2 separate power meters (a Stages and a 4iiii)
Now, fast forward to one year later. My wife “authorized” a wish-list joint birthday/Xmas present of a new Direct drive trainer of my choice so I then got myself the Kickr '18, the Kickr Climb and a dedicated trainer bike (that my LBS sold me at a price I couldn’t refuse).
I LOVE LOVE LOVE having the Kickr Climb and frankly wouldn’t ever train indoors without it. If it’s in your budget, and the Snap you’ve got on order is a newer one, I can’t say enough about how the Climb has made indoor training SOOOOO much more engaging and “enjoyable”.
Had my wife not authorized the purchase, I’d still be riding the Snap (and would have simply coveted the Climb). If I recall, the model of Snap I had wasnt compatible with the Climb so I would have had to upgrade anyway.
To answer your question directly though…I do prefer the direct drive over the wheel on. The new Kickr models don’t require calibration so the TTS (time to suffering) is reduced and there are some SUFFING awesome deals on the Kickr V5s right now. If you can afford it, you won’t regret the upgrades. It’s an investment in yourself
Agree! I feel anything the removes/reduces impediments to getting on the trainer, and anything that you find makes it less tedious and more enjoyable is very much worth considering. Obviously, being able to keep the trainer set up is a biggie. If you don’t have a bike you can dedicate to the trainer, it’s worth considering getting a inexpensive used bike that you can leave on it. One thing that made a big difference for me is full motion platform. I find it much more comfortable (aka enjoyable) to ride for longer durations with the bike moving and responding under me.
Thank you for your detailed answer. A further question though (actually two questions😊):
I typically leave my bike attached to the trainer. That is to say, I would not normally adjust the tension knob between rides. As ling as the tire pressure remains the same from one ride to another (which can easily be checked), is there really need to a spindown calibration before every ride?
I’m surprised the Climb has made that much of a difference for you. Doesn’t it just adjust the angle of the bike to correspond to virtual changes in grade? Kind of a neat idea for sure but I would not have thought that would be a game changer. How does rhat make the experience so much better?
I really would appreciate your views Glen.
Thanks!
So, first the first question. It probably doesn’t matter and ymmv but I am kind of anal about certain things so I ALWAYS released the pressure on the tire at the end of each ride. I, perhaps erroneously, just always thought that leaving it pressed against the tire wasnt good for the tire. It may have even been recommended by someone at some point. And 100% yes, a calibration is recommended at the start of each and every ride IF consistent and accurate measures of resistance are your thing (they were mine). There are other recommendations for newer Snaps on the wahoo fitness site.
Your second question: I know it sounds ridiculous that the Climb was such a game changer for me. It literally just moves the front of the bike up and down. But it TOTALLY was. It makes EVERY ride in SYSTM (even most of the old ones have been encoded with gradient changes now), soooo much more engaging. This is super noticeable on all the On Location rides and the Pro Rides but the recent BMX and MTB on the A week with UCI World Cycling Centre was that much more thrilling. Jumps as you go up, pitches when you go down. It makes these things more immersive than they already are, engages different muscles and encourages position changes. And that is just in SYSTM which isnt even a SIM program like RGT or Zwift or Rouvy or FulGaz. After I got the Climb, doing the Alpe on Zwift really felt like I was doing the Alpe. So much so that I ended up vEveresting Alpe du Zwift (9 times in a row) then did another on Leith Hill (75 reps) and then a 3rd on Ventoux (6 in a row). I NEVER would have thought about vEveresting without the Climb. In fact, during one attempt, my Climb broke (promptly replaced by Wahoo) and I just couldn’t get into indoor training without it. I dont think you will find anyone who has a Climb say they don’t like it. I may be more obsessed with it than others but I really wouldn’t ride without one. I realize that Elite makes something similar (the Rizer, I think it’s called) but it was not available back in '18 when I got the full meal deal from Wahoo.
I was in the same place as you a few years back, and went with the Snap as a “step up” smart trainer. This past year I upgraded to a Kickr, but I don’t regret the Snap years at all. It was a great smart trainer intro at (at the time) 1/3 the cost of the Kickr. And I probably got 50-60% of my cost back when I sold it off e/r to my Kickr.
Aside from that, I second everything Sir @Glen.Coutts says - including the Climb…
I had the ‘pleasure’ of testing the SNAP versus the KICKR when a local bike shop that doubled as a training centre got rid of their CompuTrainers. I would NOT even consider a wheel-on smart trainer as they have spinup and spindown issues that the wheel-off (flywheel only) do not.
The part of the Climb is quite an interesting insight. I’ve heard that the angle of the bike will make you sit just ever so slightly different (as you would outside) which in turn feels nicer and you don’t want to quit as soon as you might normally do indoor (I do most of the time. Even with some virtual ride and/or movies next to it, all above 35min becomes a mental challenge, while riding 90min in one direction outside isn’t even worth a second thought.
I think the Climb is kinda the indoor equivalent of the Garmin Varia. At first view, a rather useless, totally overpriced piece of nerdy tech. But once tried and learned to love, no longer replaceable by anything else. I got mine (Radar) back when I was mainly using Garmin, but now with my new ROAM V2 I like it even more. With the LEDs on the side switching seamlessly from Power Zone to Radar and back it’s finally 100% usable. On the Garmin it would always overlay on the display, “hiding” half if some data fields.
Now with my gravel bike, -1C and slight rain/snow isn’t a big deal, so my indoor season has not yet started, but I might have to reconsider looking at the Climb and getting one when there’s a good deal somewhere down the road.
With the Climb, the angle is not exactly as it would be outdoors because the rear of the bike doesn’t change as it would going up a hill. But it’s pretty dang close. To get that angle right, you need the Kickr Bike where the whole bike moves in proportion to the gradient. SUFfing brilliant bit of kit.
What I am gathering from all of this is that the best approach is likely to “go big or go home”. That is to say, either go full on with a full fledged Kickr or stay with what I’ve got.
I still quite like the Road Machine as it works well and gives me most of what I need so I believe I will just stay with that for now. I just can’t justify moving half way into the smart trainer realm. That said, I will post a separate thread requestIng the experiences of those using a dumb trainer with RGT.
BTW, I have a 10 year old RM. It was the device I rode into Sufferlandria on and it has done me well through four bicycles or more. I will be sticking with it for now until the issues with competition are dealt with.
Does this extend infinitely into the future Sir cuz if so, I might have some plans for you 
