Workouts and Gradient integrations

SYSTM Content
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There were some questions recently about which workouts and which workout do and do not have climb integration so I thought it would be helpful to share some details.

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A Week With
All Cycling workouts have gradient integrated :white_check_mark:

Fitness Assessments
Half Monty - gradient integrated :white_check_mark:
Full Frontal - no gradient

Inspiration
No gradient integrations except for:

  • Found in America :white_check_mark:
  • Four Shorts By Joey :white_check_mark:

NoVid
Majority do not have gradient integration, those that do are:

  • Big Gear MAP: 2 Sets 6 x 30s :white_check_mark:
  • Big Gear MAP: 3 Sets 6 x 30s :white_check_mark:
  • Big Gear Tempo: 5 x 4 :white_check_mark:
  • Big Gear Tempo/Sub-Threshold: 4 x 8 :white_check_mark:
  • Big Gear Varying Cadence: 3 x 10 :white_check_mark:
  • FTP Progression 1: 5 x 6 :white_check_mark:
  • Full Micro Rangers :white_check_mark:
  • MAP Decreasing Duration: 4/3/2/1/30s :white_check_mark:
  • MAP Micro Intervals: 3 Sets 40/20s :white_check_mark:
  • MAP: 2 Sets 6 x 1 :white_check_mark:
  • Micro Intervals: 3 Sets 8/6/4 x 40/20s :white_check_mark:
  • Sub-Threshold: 1 x 20 :white_check_mark:
  • Taper 40/20s, 30/30s, 20/40s :white_check_mark:
  • Tempo Alternating: 2 x 15 :white_check_mark:
  • Tempo Increasing Cadence: 6 x 2 :white_check_mark:
  • Tempo Increasing: 30/20/10/5min :white_check_mark:
  • Tempo With Varying Cadence: 5 x 6 :white_check_mark:
  • Tempo/FTP Progressive Build :white_check_mark:

On Location
All have gradient integration :white_check_mark:

ProRide
All have gradient integration :white_check_mark:

Sufferfest
The majority do have gradient integration, we are working towards having all those with relevant gradient integrated to the workout:

Flat workouts:

  • Half Is Easy
  • High Time
  • Joyride
  • Long Scream
  • Primers
  • Team Scream
  • The Omnium

Currently missing gradient and on the To Do list:

  • Blender (Mini Version)

Wahoo Fitness
Workouts with Gradient: :white_check_mark:

  • All Access EF 1 :white_check_mark:
  • All Access EF 2 :white_check_mark:
  • Elements Of Style :white_check_mark:

Flat Workouts:

  • Cadence Builds
  • Tapers
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Thanks, Rupert! One request I would have for a FEATURE in this regard is to find some way of MARKING THE WORKOUTS with an ICON that specifically shows that UP FRONT, as users are scrolling through the workouts to choose one. It would be SO HELPFUL to be able to SEE THAT STATUS IMMEDIATELY.

And in conjunction with that, enabling a SEARCH FILTER for this would be MARVELOUS! Then, whenever searching for workouts, users could limit the choices to only those with the gradient integration!

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Sir Rupert - Thanks for this!

Last I checked, Blender (full version), Revolver and Downward Spiral did not have gradient integration. They’re not on your list. What’s thee scoop on these three sessions?

Thanks,

Rob

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@RServranckx we are in the process of updating them, when did you last ride them?

  • Blender has gradient but mini-blender is on the to do list
  • Revolver is mainly flat so has some short gradient sections
  • Downward Spiral has gradient during the warmup and is then flat
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It’s been a long while for Blender (Feb 2022) and DS (March 2023)as I’ve been avoiding sessions with no KICKR Climb integration. I occasionally do Revolver despite its “flatness”, as I do that session in Level mode…

Do you know when climb integration was added to Blender?

As for DS, are there any plans to adding some climb integration to the intervals?

Thanks,

Rob

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How do I make my Kickr Bike V2 (Wifi and Bluetooth Connections) react to gradients in the above mentioned workouts. The hardware functionality is fine, since it works seamlessly with Zwift and Training Peaks. I tried and tested all the troubleshooting advice I could find in the Wahoo Support pages, but nothing solved the problem. From what I understand, is that the KickrBike is supposed to tilt into position according to the percentage info in the upper right screen, right. Does anyone have the same issue?

My last assumption is, that I might need an ANT connection maybe? Though: when I start the workout, the green icons (Gradient, Watts, cadence, virtual speed) all match with the connected KickrBike within the Device-PopUp window.

Grateful for any sort of hint.

Christian

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You should not need an ANT+ connection from the KICKR as long as the Bluetooth connection works. The KICKR Bike (I have V1, but I believe the same would apply on V2 ??) should only connect to whatever SYSTM app you are using (PC or phone or iPad?) with one connection type, so if it is getting the readings from the KICKR BIKE for power, cadence, etc, then it should be responding to the gradient changes too.

Are you saying that the bike does not work with ANY gradient changes on ANY workouts?

Have you made sure to UNLOCK the KICKR BIKE using the unlock button down on the side console near the front of the bike? The indicator light there will also show you if it is LOCKED or UNLOCKED.

And remember that IF YOU HIT THE BUTTONS that MANUALLY TILT the bike, that ALSO LOCKS THE BIKE AGAIN, so you have to UNLOCK IT if you want the app to control gradients again.

Hope you can figure it out and get it working. If the above doesn’t work, you might need to contact WAHOO for tech support.

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Thanks @DouthatBiker So far the Bike has never reacted to any gradient changes in any workout. Riding it for two and a half years now. Acutally, since it never reacted, I always thought it wasn‘t supposed to :smile: . Rupert‘s post and new thread in this forum made me wonder. Checked everything you mentioned above, but nothing worked. Oh, well.

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If it works in Zwift and TPV then it should work in SYSTM / Wahoo apps.

send a request to Wahoo support and they will get everything troubleshot for you.

https://support.wahoofitness.com/hc/en-us

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Very strange indeed. As @emacdoug said, if it works in another app, (Zwift… Rouvy… FulGaz), then it should indeed work in SYSTM. If it does not work in any others, that’s certainly a problem. (Though even those other apps would require you to give the app CONTROL of the KICKR BIKE. I’m assuming you already are doing that.)

So just for certainty, are you allowing the KICKR BIKE to be CONTROLLED in SYSTM? I wish I could tell you exactly how to check this in SYSTM, but since I’m not subscribing right now, I cannot actually start a workout and see the SETTINGS options right now.

But that’s what you need to be sure to check to make sure that SYSTM is what is controlling your KICKR BIKE. That means it controls your resistance if you are using ERG mode setting, and also controls the GRADIENT.

But if you have somehow unchecked/deselected whatever setting lets SYSTM control your KICKR BIKE, then that would stop it from controlling EITHER of those things, Resistance and Gradient/Tilt.

And I can’t imagine any other scenario (except the SETTINGS OPTIONS) in which the KICKR BIKE would communicate the other data (like power, cadence) and not be ABLE to also receive signals to change gradient and resistance.

Just for the record for those of us trying to help here, can you confirm that your KICKR BIKE is NOT the KICKR SHIFT (which does not have the GRADIENT Functionality), and also confirm that your bike DOES ACTUALLY TILT, at least when you press the front left TOP shifter buttons that move the tilt down and up?

That would at least confirm that your GRADIENT CONTROL MOTOR works and tilts the bike angle. If you have KICKR BIKE V2, that is basic functionality. And when you do tilt the bike either direction, you will see on the CONTROL BOX on the right side of the bike at the head tube, the LED numbers will light up briefly showing the actual TILT VALUE, like 0 for level, or +3 or -8 or whatever, changing as you continue to hit those buttons to move it up or down.

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Thanks @DouthatBiker @emacdoug
Yes, I can confirm all that:
– KickrBike V2 (not the KickrShift)
– manual tilting with the shifter buttons works well, tilting up and down with the percentage shown on the display
– Lock and unlock button works as well
– tilting in Zwift and TPV work as well (Setting Trainer difficulty to 100%).
– the Kickr Bike and my wahoo heart rate sensor appear, in the “Devices” window (see picture below, grabbed this from the support pages), with all categories green (tried to toggle the right gradient icon as well)

NOW what I will try out next ist ERG mode, since I usually do the workouts in Level Mode.

The following I found in the support pages for the Kickr CLIMB:
”Erg Mode: The Climb will raise and lower based on the gradients that we have in the workouts. Level Mode: Each of the levels in Level Mode is tied to a certain gradient. What this means for the Climb is that if you are in Level Mode the Climb will rise to that level’s assigned gradient number and remain there unless you switch to another level.”
Elsewhere in the support pages, it is stated that there is no connection between ERG/ Level Mode and the Gradient/tilting function.

I will to another check this evening (European time), trying out again different settings and different workouts (Perhaps this results in an accidental knighthood attempt).
If none of this helps, I will contact tech support. I will keep you updated.
Thanks again for your efforts! Much appreciated.

Tako / Christian

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HAH! ERG MODE does the job! @DouthatBiker @Rupert @emacdoug

Greetings from the Col des Champs!

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FABULOUS! So glad you have it working!

That image you shared in previous post helps me remember how those several icons appear, since I can’t check this for myself right now as I’m not subscribed. So I THINK that they still should work even in LEVEL MODE ALSO, but I can’t be sure. Perhaps @Rupert can confirm this?

The other thing I remember now as well is that sometimes you have to wait till the ones that are not GREEN actually TURN GREEN. And if they do not, they won’t work with THAT particular device. I used to use an ANT+ dongle attached to my PC until I stopped using ANT+ and started using the native Bluetooth on the PC exclusively. But SYSTM may STILL try using ANT+ if the dongle is there, and sometimes it would split the specific sensor features between the ANT+ and Bluetooth profiles, so I had to scroll down that screen you showed and see what was configured with what. I eventually deleted the ANT+ profile, (I think?) so that it wouldn’t confuse things. AND the WAHOO APP that is different altogether, ALSO can take the speed sensor task to itself, so it won’t show up GREEN there on that same DEVICES image screen you showed. (But I think maybe scrolling down shows a WAHOO APP device with it turned GREEN??? Not sure of that.)

The lesson here is to be sure to familiarize yourself with all the DEVICES and SETTINGS and DISPLAY options in that area. You’ll have a much better grasp of what’s possible after you tinker with that a little.

Now you’ve got a lot of SYSTM Workouts that will behave like never before with your KICKR BIKE! :partying_face::partying_face:

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Correct the gradient works in ERG or Level mode once it is selected for the device.
Here is the help center about it (sorry for the slow reply) looks like you are all set now but jut in case..

https://support.wahoofitness.com/hc/en-us/articles/4407149873810-Grade-or-Tilt-Troubleshooting-KICKR-BIKE

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I’ve just had a bike V2 delivered today.

I really would love to see something on each ride to show if climb is enabled :grinning_face::grinning_face::grinning_face:

@Rupert might that be possible :thinking::grinning_face::grinning_face::grinning_face:

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Gradient has been added to some more SUF workouts and I have updated the list above as these all now have gradient integrated:

  • Igniter :white_check_mark:
  • SUF Idol :white_check_mark:
  • The Rookie :white_check_mark:
  • The Shovel :white_check_mark:
  • The Tool Shed :white_check_mark:
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Great additions. Thanks!