Nice question. I’m afraid I can’t comment as I’m not quite perimenopausal yet. Perhaps one of the other women can comment. From what I’ve read, there are still hormones cycling round, just in WAY lower concentrations and you can still track things and adjust training. I’m not sure if this means symptom tracking is still very useful or only somewhat or if one even still gets mild symptoms at all. Obviously the big indicators at menopause are gone.
I do know protein and strength work (lift heavy sh*t) becomes even more important. I am super focussed on my protein intake and strength work now, in my 40s. I look at my parents vs inlaws and I can really see the dramatic difference having an active adulthood has as one ages. My Dad still does gym, swims, walks miles every day and plays squash and has ace muscle tone. At 70. Whereas FIL is extremely sedentary and frail.
Hi again, I forgot to answer this part of your question. Yes I’m on a 3:1 plan. I make sure to start it on the Monday as close to day 1 of my cycle as possible, and that gets me a rest week in the last week of my cycle, which is when I should be having a rest week hormone wise. So it aligns reasonably well.
Then yes exactly this, I use my app to check what my “readiness” score is and what phase I am in and what symptoms are cropping up. E.g. phase 2 for me lasts longer than a week, more like 10 days, so sometimes I have to shuffle things around a little but not too much. Mostly the plan works well for me. But I am lucky with a standard 28 day cycle, ehich while it may be the average length, I don’t believe it is the norm. None of my women friends have a 28 day cycle.
Interestingly enough, when my nutrition is on point, my symptoms are less, and I can actually manage one or two very smash fest rides in that last week of the block, I just have to take recovery EXTRA seriously (extra sleep and much more couch time, rather than active zone 1 recovery) otherwise I get sick. So now that I think about it, that approach would mean women can race and do very well on any day of their cycle, they just need to manage their nutrition and recovery carefully to support it. Multi day stage races are another thing altogether. I’m prepared to get in touch with one of our Kiwi pro cyclists (she’s riding Giro Donna right now) and ask her if you’re interested. Her coach is exceptional and takes hormone cycles into account. She suffered from RED-s before from training without taking hormones into account (different coach). So am interested to see what she says about multi day races and hormone phases. They put up a different team for each race, so I wonder if that comes into it.
Yes I am very interested for two reasons. One, I am just interested in all things about human biology. Second, I have athletic female friends with whom I discuss fitness.
Sleep is very important. It, along with nutrition, are the only two proven recovery techniques. One of my current sub-goals for Mt Sufferlandria is to focus on getting the right amount of sleep each night. It does make a fantastic amount of difference. After that, I will focus on nutrition. Since there is an enormous amount of variability with that, I am thinking of higher a coach that specializes in nutrition.
Completely agree here. I am finding I need more sleep post Covid. 7.5 was my optimal pre Covid. I’m finding I need 8.5 to 9 hours now.
And Nutrition…I feel foul even if I eat reasonably well. This is because eating perfectly right has me feeling so awesome. I opted to spend money on a Nutritionist/Dietician rather than a cycling coach, and it has been worth every penny, can highly recommend it. Make sure it is someone you are comfortable with. Mine is a woman, similar age to me and also an endurance athlete, so she can relate to my situation. Plus she doesn’t force a 1 size fits all approach to food on anyone, which is brilliant. I currently don’t have a set diet plan which I would battle with. Instead I have a few simple targets. At the moment these are:
- Hit my protein target daily
- No processed food
- No grains and dairy (I have IBS and this helps tremendously) but does make it hard to get carbs for fuel, but we have some strategies there.
- Double breakfast for me at the moment (front loading my calories and protein) because my cortisol is mega high post Covid, so this helps massively stabilise my blood sugar levels for the day.
We tweak these monthly.
I am slightly younger than your dad, and I can reinforce your observation of the effects of active adulthood as well. I have seen many friends and relatives (who are now around my age), who have not been active get into a vicious circle which makes even everyday activity difficult.
They get overweight, so their knees are bad which makes it hard for them to be active. They then need joint replacements. Since this makes them less likely to be active they become more overweight. Being diabetic soon follows which exacerbates other conditions such as high blood pressure. It is a downward spiral that gets harder and harder to reverse.
It’s hard aye. Especially hard for people who just never were inclined to be active as adults. We have a gentleman near me who is well into his late 80s who still rides every day. We were stopped at the lights together one day and chatted and he said he’d ridden every single day since he was 8. I was quite fit at the time, but he dropped me easily.
So you use the word “gentlemen” loosely! 
I will no lounger be in my “late 50s” next year! I’m more a runner than a cyclist but would like to be more like this “gentleman” and ride every day. Especially as I get older and the knees (which are fine now) may need some TLC as the years go by.
Actually I did the FF 2 weeks ago and was still categorised as a sprinter. I guess it is what it is right now since I have a pretty good NM (despite my not too great FTP and MAP) but I am also capable to nail the AC portion at the end of the FF with ease.
Maybe, just maybe I am in between being both a sprinter and an attacker? 
Then again as you have put it, there are other factors at play and feeling great for a particular day as well as having enough sleep the night before tops the list for me.
As for a bad day at work, well, I try not to let it get it me since I take my rides in the evening after work as my way to de-stress from work. But there’s a caveat to this though, couchlandrian tendencies. 
Well he did offer me a tow! I like to tell myself he was on an eBike. He wasn’t 
Then he’s well worthy of a title of a gentleman.
Could this gentleman in question be GvA in disguise? 
No, if he was, he would have given an evil laugh and thrown a grin over his shoulder as he easily dropped me when I was pushing 450 watts.
I would suspect he’s one heck of a very fit golden aged gentleman. I did come across one gentleman last year (whom I suspect is elder than my father) whilst doing a cool-down ride around the housing area which I did to speak to, took a great deal of interest in cycling and even cycled from Malaysia all the way to Europe at the age of 60 and till this day still runs marathon.
I am no where close to those figures except when doing sprints and I know I need to work harder. Would you please be so kind to direct me to the most suitable flogging station?
I was close to sprinting
That’s amazing nevertheless! 
That’s fantastic, maybe I’ll be able to pass you and take the podium then. Attrition of the age brackets for the win!!!
IMO, SYSTM provides adequate information, knowledge, education and foresight to the (general) plans they offer to all and sundry. Should one be requiring individualised training, access to an in-house coach is available.
I have no expectation from any online training platform to provide an individualised personalised plan for my unique circumstance as a standard offering.
Regarding age as a number, I am 52, Suunto Fitness Age says 20, I race Masters, usually finish top 20% GC (includes all age groups), either podium or top 10 within category, have a current CTL of 131, ATL has been up to 180 (dependent upon wherein the structured plan I am), train ave 15 hours per week on a 3:1 rotation. Power metrics have deivated by as much as a 12% range, being mindful that such numbers are a snapshot at that moment in time and do not carry forward forever and a day, numbers change due to training stimulus/stresses, life stresses, and point in time wrt to racing/recovery seasons.
Age is really just a number that should not be given too much consideration. Rather focus should be on training history, lifestyle history and future goals. This a coach can do. If one is serious about performance, use of a coach is priority. Standard plans on offer without any deviation from them, are useful to make a social rider competivie within their cycling circle.
I do agree with you that age is not a good input to standardized plans because of the wide dispersion of ability, which actually increases with age. Part of the problem is that Wahoo’s marketing pushes the ability of the plans to be customized to your 4DP and rider type.
Nonetheless, if the vast majority of the riders in the data set are below say 50, the probability that a plan being useful for me (I am much older than you are) is small. In fact, I find the plans are basically useless. I have to build my own.
Now there is much more in Sufferlandria (whoops, should I say SYSTM?) than plans. I have stated elsewhere that I came for the plans, but I stayed because of the workouts - including mental training, strength, yoga, and mobility.
Nonetheless, the idea that age is just a number is a socially convenient fiction that we tell ourselves. It is based on people who are statistical outliers. The unfortunate fact is that the older we get, the more problems we are likely to have. Many of those problems are beyond our control, and affect our ability to exercise.
I accept you have a differing opinion and disagree with your opinion.
We see things differently, you in a generalised manner and myself in a specified manner.
Thank you for your input.
Pretty much agree, as is evidenced by my previous posts in this thread I started. But I do believe age can and should be an input that adjusts workouts. There are plenty of data how age affects training response and athletic performance. That said, I agree there is fairly wide dispersion about the average, so including testing to further characterize that, and lacking that, a ‘fitness age’ dial that could adjust +/- from that average curve is doable. Will it sell sufficiently more WahooX subscriptions to justify doing it? I kinda doubt it.
I PROBABLY should not even walk into this minefield… but
This month makes me 65. I don’t find ANY plans that would suit me. Not here or elsewhere. I’m not much of a PLANNER when it comes to riding my bike. I do it for fun, for personal achievement, for fitness, for social interaction SOMETIMES, and for maybe another dozen reasons if I thought about it. I’m sure many of you could add to these for yourselves, and subtract some too.
But since joining SYSTM just over a year ago, my only use of a plan has been just to throw a lot of workouts onto a calendar and then pick from them WHEN I choose to ride inside. It was helpful to see how the plan was constructed on a schedule and how it varied. I’ve ridden MAYBE 10-15% of the rides overall. Mostly, I go outside and ride if I can manage it, and I really don’t try to match those rides up to the indoor schedule. It just isn’t reasonable to me to work that out.
But I’ve continued to learn AND to benefit from the plan, and I definitely find it easier to do ANAEROBIC efforts, especially Sprints, on my KICKR Bike inside. I do others for sure, but I NEED those bits in my mix more than I ever included in the past before the KICKR Bike and SYSTM.
What I’m thinking is that IF I wanted to (or were for any reason FORCED to) do most or all of my rides inside on the KICKR, and IF I wanted to follow a plan for whatever reason, I would still select a plan according to what is already offered in SYSTM for whatever goal or purpose I had in mind. That would include choosing the 2-1 vs 3-1 approach that I think my age would support best.
And THEN as I worked the plan, I think I would do a combination of things to make it more achievable for me.
If I found I couldn’t sustain as many of a particular type of workout as the plan included, I would simply start substituting something that I did need or want. Change the focus as needed.
Another option would be to use the Settings change to reduce FTP percentage on days I felt I needed less, (or more? 
)
The use of a paid coach is certainly legitimate for some. But I think just having access to the plans at all is quite a boon to the app for any that want them. I KNOW that Saddlesaur and Heretic and many others are experienced and sharp folks who already know a lot of ways to accommodate a plan to their specific needs. I also think that anyone that wants to learn can get a lot of information and make adjustments as they interact with SYSTM and what it offers. That’s part of the fun, I think, of learning over time how your own body works and what it responds to and what it doesn’t.
I’m not arguing against “plans for old guys like me” but I wonder just how different they would be, really. As some have said, when stuff happens and you can’t do what’s on the plan, improvise… take time out… try cross-training with something you CAN do…
It’s a moving target for all of us!